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[00:56:08] <Ronin22222> Hi. I'm trying to install Rockbox on a first getn phat iPod Classic. I'm trying to install emcore but I can't get my ipod to do anything after I eject it after putting the installer-ipodclassic.ubi file on the UMS drive. The screen on the ipod doesn't change and when I hold Menu + Select to reboot the ipod it just goes back to the apple screen
[00:56:56] <Ronin22222> I'm stuck at line 4 on these instructions where it says follow onscreen instructions. The only instructions on screen are if you loaded that up by mistake and to reset
[00:56:57] <Ronin22222> http://freemyipod.org/wiki/EmCORE_Installation/iPodClassic/UMSboot
[00:57:26] <Ronin22222> this is the 2nd time I tried to do this from scratch. I reset my ipod using itunes after the first failed attempt
[00:59:36] <user890104> Ronin22222: please use the Eject option on the drive itself (in Computer), not in the system tray
[01:00:21] <Ronin22222> that's what I did was from the system tray. Where exactly do you mean in Computer? You mean in Explorer if I click on the drive?
[01:00:30] <user890104> yes
[01:00:44] <Ronin22222> ok thanks man. I'll try that
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[01:11:13] <Ronin22222> I just wanted to come back and say thank you for the help. I've got it installed and it's working great
[01:12:05] <user890104> you're welcome
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[07:17:10] <drox> Hello. Trying to install the bootloader on my Ipod 6G and the bootloader won't recognize the Ipod. It is connected in DFU mode to my computer, but device manager says there is not driver for it.
[07:18:32] <[Saint]> Go back and make sure you follow the directions very varefully.
[07:18:38] <[Saint]> *carefully
[07:19:03] <[Saint]> This indeed points to a problem on your end. Until that is resolved, I can't help you with anything.
[07:19:48] <drox> I have.
[07:19:59] <drox> The processes are not running.
[07:20:46] <[Saint]> I know it sucks to hear it - but, you're definitely doing _something_ wrong.
[07:21:33] <drox> Please don't patronize me. I've followed the directions to the tee. I've tried multiple methods
[07:21:58] <[Saint]> I'm not trying to patronize you, I'm simply stating a fact.
[07:22:06] <drox> It's not a fact if you're wrong.
[07:22:23] <[Saint]> You may find that the "without iTune" method allows you to procede by way of removing these obstacles.
[07:22:28] <drox> The iPod shows up in Device Manager as a DFU mode device. There is no device driver for it, however, so the bootstrap program does not detect it.
[07:22:39] <drox> I have tried that method along with the itunes method.
[07:22:57] <[Saint]> Well...this works for countless other individuals.
[07:23:32] <drox> Well that's why I'm here for help and they aren't.
[07:23:35] <[Saint]> The only other suggestion I have is using the linus installation instructions in a virtual machine or liveCD.
[07:23:45] <[Saint]> *linux
[07:24:01] <drox> The directions say the device should connect as an "Apple Recovery (DFU) USB Driver" device. I have confirmed it is not.
[07:24:19] <[Saint]> Without being right there looking over your shoulder I can't say what it is you're missing, but, its _something_.
[07:24:21] <drox> Is there a place to download this driver manually? This seems to be the step that is not working as the directions state it should
[07:24:40] <[Saint]> No.
[07:25:40] <[Saint]> I would highly advice using a liveCD of a "real" operating system.
[07:25:47] <[Saint]> ie. not Windows
[07:26:47] <drox> There is in fact a place to download this driver
[07:26:51] <drox> http://www.freemyipod.org/wiki/EmCORE_Installation/iPodClassic/DFUNoiTunes
[07:26:56] <drox> But that driver has an invalid signature,
[07:27:08] <drox> It is becoming more clear to me that this is not a problem on my end.
[07:27:44] <[Saint]> Were that the case the "with itunes" method should function.
[07:28:20] <drox> No, it wouldn't, since you put the ipod in DFU mode in all 3 methods.
[07:28:32] <drox> And that happens to be the step that does not work as it should
[07:28:51] <[Saint]> Right, but, iTunes already has this driver...
[07:29:24] <drox> Not the DFU driver, just a normal ipod driver
[07:29:54] <[Saint]> Incorrect.
[07:29:59] <drox> Christ almighty
[07:30:21] <[Saint]> iTunes most definitely does include the DFU driver.
[07:30:39] <drox> You are useless. You should leave this support channel as you've done nothing but vehemently defend this shit when it clearly does not work.
[07:30:41] <[Saint]> I can tell you you're correct if you want, but it won;t make it true.
[07:30:51] <drox> You're a moron.
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[09:09:16] <user890104> lol
[09:12:24] <[Saint]> I had to make a pastebin of this and check to see that I didn't antagonize this guy and that I didn't deserve such a rection. :-/ 
[09:12:36] <[Saint]> It left me feeling rather deflated.
[09:27:15] <user890104> i finally reworded the instructions yesterday, so people won't eject their ipods "incorrectly" on windows anymore
[09:27:59] <user890104> but this guy just doesn't want to listen, because he thinks he already tried the instructions correctly, and is too lazy to redo
[09:29:20] <user890104> btw, umsboot sometimes just doesn't mount. at all. and redoing the bootstrap thing fixes that, for unknown reasons
[09:30:11] <[Saint]> Well, he apparently repeated it multiple times.
[09:30:31] <[Saint]> There was only so many different ways I could word "Sorry, but, you're doing something wrong".
[09:30:48] <[Saint]> I even gave him a workable solution.
[09:31:01] <user890104> IIUC, he tried each of the methods once
[09:31:07] <user890104> or not?
[09:31:48] <[Saint]> Hmmmm, looking at it now, its rather open for interpretation.
[09:32:14] <[Saint]> He states he tried "multiple methods", but, since there's only 2 methods I took that to mean he tried multiple times.
[09:32:26] <[Saint]> (only 2 *Windows* methods)
[09:32:33] <user890104> there are 3 windows methods :)
[09:32:50] <[Saint]> There are?
[09:33:03] <user890104> itunes, itunes drivers, non-itunes
[09:33:07] <[Saint]> Oh, w/ iTunes, without iTunes, Zadig?
[09:33:13] <[Saint]> Ah.
[09:33:25] <user890104> http://freemyipod.org/wiki/EmCORE_Installation/iPodClassic/ChooseMethod
[09:33:51] <user890104> and the non-itunes is currently broken
[09:34:00] <user890104> because it uses an ancient UMSboot
[09:34:23] <user890104> and if i rebuild it with the new one, the bootstrapper's DFU upload code stops working
[09:34:33] <[Saint]> Once he started stating things as fact that just plain weren't true - I gave up.
[09:34:57] <[Saint]> I tried pushing him at an OS that makes it virtually impossible to fuck it up, but, no dice.
[09:35:46] <[Saint]> Each of the Windows variants presents an opportunity for the user to so something wrong when they believe themselves to not be doing so.
[09:36:14] <user890104> yes, that's why i'm going to attach screenshots when i have time
[09:36:54] <user890104> "did you do what the picture shows?" "no" "then you're doing it wrong"
[09:37:05] <user890104> as easy as that :)
[09:37:30] <[Saint]> I was thinking about releasing a debian live image where the user just has to boot, get into DFU, and run a script.
[09:38:51] <[Saint]> Don't need a GUI, or any other bullshit, just boot into a prompt that guides the user to enter DFU, then press Enter when they're ready.
[09:39:15] <user890104> i was thinking of making a .bat script, that uses curl to download phobos.apple.com/version (or something like that), then parse it, find the itunes' download url, get that, extract it, run the Apple Mobile Device Support and be done with it
[09:39:35] <user890104> and as a bonus, uninstall apple's sh*t when the bootstrapper is done
[09:39:59] <user890104> regular users are a bit scared of command line tools
[09:40:09] <[Saint]> I wanted to avoid Windows, but, it seems like we're on a similar page,
[09:40:22] <user890104> they don't have ok and cancel buttons, you need to read text and type on the keyboard
[09:40:27] <[Saint]> I didn't want it to be a commandline tool as such.
[09:40:28] <user890104> they are used to clicking
[09:40:42] <[Saint]> Just a prompt that guides them to enter DFU and press Enter when ready.
[09:41:07] <[Saint]> If they can't read or manipulate a button, they shouldn't be here ;)
[09:41:18] <user890104> not without a picture of an ipod with turned off screen, and a large-font youtube link for entering DFU
[09:41:20] <user890104> :)
[09:41:58] <[Saint]> Can we detect DFU mode once we're in it?
[09:42:19] <[Saint]> Like, could I poll for it and then print "yay, you did it - now press Enter"
[09:42:43] <[Saint]> AFAIK the answer to that is no, but, I'm curious.
[09:42:52] <user890104> that's what most jb tools do
[09:43:06] <[Saint]> Aha. So it must be possible.
[09:43:09] <[Saint]> Hmmmm.
[09:43:38] <user890104> of course, you can walk over the list of usb devices, and check if the one you expect is there
[09:44:03] <user890104> redsn0w even does it on startup
[09:44:11] * [Saint] is actually very motivated to get this done
[09:44:32] <[Saint]> After crushing the image, I imagine I can get it rather small.
[09:45:10] <[Saint]> But, in saying that, writing a liveCD image to a bootable disk is probably too much of a challenge.
[09:45:29] <[Saint]> If they can't manage the instructions, I doubt they'll manage this either.
[09:45:32] <[Saint]> Fuck it.
[09:45:40] <user890104> feel free to do it, then i can host it on files.freemyipod.org
[09:45:47] <user890104> they can use a GUI image burning app
[09:46:01] * [Saint] nods
[09:46:10] <user890104> which should be as easy as ms word's print dialog
[09:47:11] <[Saint]> I wouldn't want to be directly responsible for someone writing an image to the wrong disk...but, I imagine this would benefit more people than it harmed.
[09:47:26] <[Saint]> Its just that there's a potential to do a great amount of harm that worries me.
[09:48:35] <[Saint]> I wouldn't want someone pointing a finger at me for them accidentally nuking their OS partition. ;)
[09:50:49] * user890104 remembers this script: http://websvn.freemyipod.org/filedetails.php?repname=freemyipod&path=%2Ftools%2Finstall-classic.sh
[09:51:51] <[Saint]> blast from the past.
[09:52:17] <user890104> the worst thing you can do, is to place a file on their partition
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[12:01:45] <TheSeven> that guy looked like a huge messed up mixup between both installation methods
[12:02:03] <TheSeven> user890104: does unplugging and replugging make it mount in that situation?
[12:02:19] <TheSeven> is it somewhat reproducible, i.e. can you get a USB trace of that happening?
[12:02:24] <TheSeven> which OS?
[12:08:22] <TheSeven> [Saint]: they can't point at you anymore if they have nuked their OS :P
[13:22:40] <user890104> TheSeven: haven't tried that, it hasn't happened to me yet
[13:22:48] <user890104> but to some people asking for support
[13:23:11] <user890104> it was either that, or the system tray eject
[13:23:26] <user890104> i think i've done enough to prevent the latter
[13:24:18] <user890104> so if we fix that bug in umsboot, there will be no support requests at all :P
[13:24:55] <user890104> unless some confused guys like the last one, decide that it's our fault that they can't follow instructions
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[19:17:04] <TheSeven> user890104: only if you don't count the DFU-caused problems
[19:19:31] <user890104> TheSeven: maybe it's time to move forward and either make an automated driver installer for windows, or a rbutil "addon" for ipod classic
[19:20:14] <user890104> the second one sounds like a better idea, and i can start making it, if i find documentation on how to add a new target/install method
[19:20:50] <TheSeven> I'd try to get the usual rbutil maintainers to do that
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[19:37:33] <copper> hi
[19:37:55] <copper> why would the OF work and not emCORE?
[19:38:13] <TheSeven> copper: context?
[19:38:26] <copper> TheSeven: logs in #rockbox
[19:42:50] <copper> TheSeven: I suppose we should continue this here
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[19:55:28] <copper> TheSeven: formatting
[19:55:36] <copper> (emcore installer)
[19:55:45] <TheSeven> does that seem to actually work?
[19:55:54] <copper> nope
[19:56:14] <copper> "error formatting hard drive: 80000038"
[19:56:21] <copper> I also got the BBT panic
[19:57:16] <TheSeven> did you also get a "Storage init error" message?
[19:57:43] <TheSeven> and which error code does the BBT error have?
[19:59:13] <copper> I didn't have a "storage init error"
[19:59:20] <copper> BBT error 8000006
[20:00:44] <TheSeven> this means that a 500msec ata_wait_for_start_of_transfer timeout failed
[20:01:06] <copper> which means?
[20:01:19] <TheSeven> that the card apparently didn't respond in time
[20:01:50] <copper> is that fixable?
[20:01:52] <TheSeven> internally it failed with in ata_wait_for_not_bsy
[20:02:11] <TheSeven> so it might actually be that the card just takes very long to initialize and thus fails a timeout for the first transfer after powerup
[20:02:50] <TheSeven> I wonder how you can possibly get a BBT error but not a storage init error though
[20:03:01] <TheSeven> something is apparently still eating error codes somewhere
[20:03:02] <copper> I'm afraid to ask: would it be possible to make a modified build that waits longer?
[20:03:30] <copper> note that I'm not the only one with that adapter, that card and this problem
[20:03:30] <TheSeven> I'll have to take a look at that error propagation logic anyway
[20:04:01] <copper> I think we all made the mistake to buy the one branded card that is significantly cheaper than the other ones
[20:04:17] <copper> it's a class 10 though
[20:05:19] <TheSeven> in my experience class 10 cards are neither really good for sequential performance (you should use UHS1 there) nor for random access, where most class 4 and class 6 cards perform better
[20:05:38] <TheSeven> just about any card should be fast enough for an ipod though ;)
[20:09:08] <copper> it is UHS 1
[20:12:49] <TheSeven> oh right, the bbt error isn't even critical
[20:13:13] <TheSeven> in that case emcore just assumes that there is no BBT, which is fine for most cases
[20:13:22] <copper> the OF works though, and other users report the same
[20:14:21] <TheSeven> yeah that just explains why you didn't get the messages that I thought
[20:14:57] <TheSeven> ok, so let's have a look at all of those timeouts
[20:15:10] <copper> thanks for looking into this :)
[20:15:20] <copper> considering this is a totally non-supported mod
[20:15:21] <TheSeven> identify waits for not busy for 10 seconds, then waits for 10 seconds for the actual data transfer, seems fine
[20:15:43] <TheSeven> you're not the only one to have trouble with that mod though, and I'd really like to figure out what's actually causing this mess
[20:15:56] <copper> indeed
[20:16:15] <TheSeven> set_feature has a 500msec not busy timeout before and after the command, is likely fine as well
[20:17:20] <copper> to be clear, when I unplug the ipod after copying the ubi file in dfu mode, it reboots, shows the BBT error, continues to load while displaying dots, and the installer runs
[20:17:22] <TheSeven> powerdown waits for up to a second for not busy before setting some registers, then waiting another second for not busy again, waiting another 30ms just in case, and then shuts off power
[20:17:35] <copper> then the install "formats", and I get the "error formatting hard drive: 80000038" error
[20:17:45] <TheSeven> that might be a bit troublesome if some sd cards don't actually commit their stuff before they deassert busy
[20:19:12] <copper> I think my 32 GB SDHC card would work
[20:19:17] <TheSeven> for read/write operations, we first wait up to 100ms for not busy (might be a bit tight), then issue the command, then wait another 500ms for (not busy and receiving data)
[20:19:27] <TheSeven> the second one was failing for the BBT read
[20:19:43] <copper> never mind that last bit, I don't know
[20:19:48] <TheSeven> in the not busy phase, it didn't even check for data transfers yet
[20:22:13] <copper> incidentally, I think the "formatting" sequence lasts 10 seconds, though I'd have to time it
[20:22:43] <TheSeven> so the formatting sequence (which is likely a write call at this layer) returns error 38
[20:23:25] <TheSeven> that's a failed storage_write_sectors_md for the superblock in mkfat32
[20:24:06] <TheSeven> which failed with RC 8000000e
[20:24:48] <TheSeven> hm... that status code doesn't make sense
[20:25:19] <TheSeven> or maybe it does
[20:25:46] <TheSeven> that's ata_rw_chunk failing with RC 80000003
[20:26:14] <TheSeven> which is ata_wait_for_end_of_transfer failing with RC 80000000
[20:26:44] <TheSeven> which is ata_wait_for_not_bsy failing with RC 80000000
[20:27:15] <TheSeven> which is TIMEOUT_EXPIRED(startusec, timeout)
[20:27:32] <TheSeven> so we have two failed timeouts here
[20:27:43] <TheSeven> the second one actually makes sense for huge flash memory devices
[20:27:52] <copper> http://www.kingston.com/datasheets/sd10v_en.pdf
[20:30:24] <TheSeven> hm, getting a weird error while building umsboot
[20:34:21] <TheSeven> hm, weird glitch. recompiling from scratch fixed it
[20:34:47] <TheSeven> copper: I've updated the installer file, can you try the new one?
[20:34:50] <copper> sure
[20:35:27] <copper> same URL?
[20:35:48] <TheSeven> yes
[20:36:47] <copper> BBT error 80000006
[20:37:01] <copper> then the installer runs
[20:37:27] <copper> error formatting hard drive 80000038
[20:37:38] <copper> but this time the error showed up very fast
[20:37:54] <copper> a couple seconds maybe
[20:38:16] <TheSeven> I increased one timeout from 500ms to 2000ms and another one from 100ms to 2000ms
[20:38:28] <TheSeven> it should have been stuck at formatting for about 2 seconds
[20:38:42] <TheSeven> and previously for just a few milliseconds, which it apparently wasn't?
[20:39:03] <TheSeven> did the formatting screen show any progress before the error occurred?
[20:39:49] <copper> no
[20:41:07] <TheSeven> I don't get how increasing timeouts can make it fail faster...
[20:42:12] <copper> I tried it again
[20:42:22] <copper> this time, the "formatting" screen was on for 25-30 seconds
[20:42:30] <copper> then failed with 80000038
[20:43:01] <copper> also, is it normal that after force-rebooting it still shows the old emcore version?
[20:43:27] <TheSeven> yes, because it doesn't flash anything if formatting failed
[20:43:29] <copper> I see the newer revision after installing on umsboot
[20:43:31] <copper> ok
[20:44:06] <TheSeven> I assume you flashed the old one before you installed the CF/SD mod?
[20:44:15] <copper> yes a long time ago
[20:44:26] <copper> erm, and earlier today
[20:44:42] <copper> (after installing the mod)
[20:45:03] <copper> (a long time ago before the mod, then again right after the mod)
[20:45:35] <TheSeven> hm, it should be doing a total of 4 tries of writing that sector
[20:45:58] <TheSeven> each waiting up to 4 seconds (2 for begin and 2 for end of transfer) + a bit of DMA time etc.
[20:48:00] <TheSeven> ok, I made another one, same URL
[20:48:03] <copper> ok
[20:48:07] <TheSeven> this time 10 seconds timeout, which is just insane
[20:48:15] <TheSeven> if it still fails that, the problem is definitely somewhere else
[20:48:36] <TheSeven> do you have a CF reader around to check if the CF adapter has some trouble with the SD card?
[20:49:00] <copper> nope
[20:51:42] <copper> it shows "emCORE v0.2.3 r928M" for a really long time, then the ATA error 80000006
[20:51:54] <copper> (while reading BBT etc)
[20:52:21] <copper> it's stuck on that for now
[20:52:46] <copper> now the installer is loading
[20:53:43] <copper> formatting
[20:54:15] <TheSeven> hm, so any read/write requests just time out for no apparent reason
[20:55:05] <copper> stuck on formatting for 70 seconds, then the ATA error *38
[21:03:14] <copper> TheSeven: is it possible that the card's firmware simply fails to read sector 0?
[21:03:29] <TheSeven> it also fails to write it
[21:03:34] <copper> the maker of the adapter says that "rebuilding" the MBR / partition table is necessary
[21:03:49] <copper> and I assume that emcore wants to read/write from sector 0?
[21:04:07] <TheSeven> everything that wants to access a card first wants to read sector 0
[21:04:48] <copper> if that card has a problem with that, like the guy is suggesting, then I don't see what you could possibly do
[21:05:26] <TheSeven> if the card would have a problem with that, the card would be just broken
[21:05:35] <TheSeven> and not work with any device in any way
[21:05:40] <copper> I don't think that would be particularly surprising
[21:05:54] <TheSeven> who said that btw?
[21:06:02] <TheSeven> and in which context?
[21:06:05] <copper> the guy who designs and manufactures the adapter
[21:06:12] <copper> http://www.tarkan.info/20140310/tutorials/prepare-sdxc-exfat-for-use-with-the-ipod
[21:08:26] <TheSeven> that page is just nonsense
[21:08:34] <copper> :(
[21:08:45] <TheSeven> if the card would still be formatted as exFAT, the ipod wouldn't be able to access files on it at all, no matter which firmware
[21:09:34] <copper> TheSeven: should I try a 32 GB SDHC card or would there be no point to it?
[21:09:42] <TheSeven> it's definitely worth a try
[21:09:53] <copper> ok, let me install the thing
[21:10:13] <TheSeven> I suspect that the CF adapter has a problem with the SD card, or that it isn't happy with the ATA commands that we're using
[21:14:54] <copper> ok I formatted the 32 GB SDHC card from emcore and loading the fallback Rockbox image
[21:14:57] <copper> no problem
[21:15:19] <TheSeven> ok, so we're facing a card incompatibility here
[21:15:25] <copper> rockbox info reads 29.7 GB free
[21:19:52] <copper> TheSeven: why does the OF work though?
[21:20:09] <TheSeven> does it?
[21:20:12] <copper> it does
[21:20:19] <TheSeven> with that combination of CF adapter and SD card?
[21:20:22] <copper> yes
[21:20:32] <copper> I managed to restore the OF, copy files onto it, play them back
[21:20:43] <copper> the about menu reads 116 GB (which is correct)
[21:21:12] <TheSeven> I wonder how that could possibly depend on the both the OS and the SD card behind an ATA bridge...
[21:22:00] <copper> I think I'm just gonna wait until next month to buy a real 3.3V 128 GB ZIF SSD
[21:22:06] <copper> and ditch the adapter
[21:22:15] <copper> (well, sell it to some head-fier)
[21:22:47] * TheSeven still waits for someone to do a real ipod classic SD mod
[21:23:31] <TheSeven> given that the hardware can talk to SD cards natively, without CF adapters, it's just a matter of some software and a ZIF to SD adapter cable
[21:23:37] <copper> or, I can try again when I receive my 64 GB microsdxc card with an SD adapter that I lent to pamaury
[21:24:20] <copper> that would be kinda nuts (card to adapter to adapter to ZIF board)
[21:25:59] <copper> I'm really not interested in running the OF again
[21:26:10] <user890104> TheSeven: are the ZIF connector pins (except the power supply of course) actually GPIOs?
[21:27:43] <TheSeven> yes
[21:29:05] <user890104> now i see what you mean by "real SD mod" :)
[21:35:13] <TheSeven> the ipod has a full SDIO interface on these pins
[21:35:19] <TheSeven> they use it in the CEATA version
[21:35:25] <TheSeven> which is actually ATA over SDIO
[21:35:36] <TheSeven> so why not talk MMC over SDIO instead ;)
[21:36:47] <copper> the latest Rockbox build with my themes runs super fast on the 32 GB card
[21:38:07] <copper> copies files over USB at 10 MB/s
[21:39:39] <copper> but I can't buy a more expensive SDXC card, since there's a chance I might run into the same problem
[21:39:43] <copper> I'll just buy the SSD
[21:40:23] <copper> and I guess I'll use the current 128 GB card in my camera
[21:40:26] <copper> :-/
[21:40:38] <copper> (I don't nearly need that much space on my camera)
[21:41:38] <copper> gah
[21:41:43] <copper> every song loads instantly
[21:41:49] <copper> :'-(
[21:43:45] <copper> blah
[21:44:15] <copper> TheSeven: I'll get peanuts by reselling the adaptor - would you have any use for it? I could just ship it to you.
[21:46:21] <copper> (for free, if that wasn't clear)
[21:46:38] <copper> I wouldn't expect you to fix the problem and ship it back, I'll just buy the SSD next month
[21:46:56] <copper> it costs like 25 bucks new, so there's little point in trying to resell it
[21:52:21] <TheSeven> copper: I'll take it before it ends up in the trash can. not quite sure if I'll get around to doing anything with it though.
[21:57:30] <copper> ok
[21:57:39] <copper> send me your details at gcocatre@gmail.com
[21:58:07] <copper> I'll think it over some more, if there's any way I can salvage it, and failing any option I haven't thought about, I'll ship it to you
[21:58:40] <copper> 32 GB is not nearly enough for my needs
[22:00:50] <copper> even if the 64 GB microsdxc card works, I'd rather use it with my phone
[22:20:02] * TheSeven wonders why people still use anything but phones for this purpose anyway ;)
[22:20:58] * user890104 doesn't have 120 GB of storage inside his phone yet
[22:22:27] * copper neither
[22:22:40] * TheSeven streams that over the internet
[22:23:04] <copper> oh, you're german?
[22:23:07] <TheSeven> yes
[22:23:12] <copper> shipping's gonna be cheap
[22:23:18] <TheSeven> where are you located?
[22:23:23] <copper> south of France
[22:25:12] <copper> I'll be using my phone for a while
[22:25:48] * TheSeven has abandoned his "offline" music collection for years now
[22:25:54] <TheSeven> I'm mostly using spotify these days
[22:26:08] <copper> that seems to be the current trend
[22:26:18] * user890104 wonders if spotify is supported in Bulgaria
[22:26:31] <TheSeven> it is
[22:27:25] <TheSeven> apparently it's even free and unlimited for desktop usage
[22:28:25] <user890104> can you open the homepage?
[22:28:36] <user890104> http://i.imgur.com/dulhUsn.png
[22:30:35] <TheSeven> works here, but is lagging badly
[22:30:50] <user890104> ah, it finally loaded